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 Post subject: Updating feats
PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 5:21 pm 
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Some updates to the feats for six20 are over here...

http://www.rhombicelephant.co.uk/six20/ ... eatsUpdate

Please comment - particularly on whether the changes appear overpowered.

(This isn't in the Homebrew section, as without the six20 rules, it'll make no sense to the masses.)

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 11:52 am 
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Added some proposals to make ranged combat more attractive.

BTW: no comments so far ... are there really no opinions? I'd be grateful for feedback.

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 4:03 pm 
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I'm going to assume that we're all happy to playtest these feats as they're written, starting next session...

You may need to tweak your character if your feats have improved / merged. If you gain a feat slot, feel free to take a new one that you qualify for.

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 4:39 pm 
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Just read through them all, they all seem like valid changes to me.

I do have one concern,

"Projectile weapons add DEX modifier to damage"

This pretty much writes off right on the nose, as I now get sec bonus to all ranged attacks instead of just thrown weapons


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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:36 pm 
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Right on the nose replaces your STR mod with your DEX mod four thrown weapons - so you can ignore STR penalties (which feeble halflings are likely to have).

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:45 pm 
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Ah!

So thrown weapons aren't projectile weapons?


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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 6:03 pm 
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No, projectile weapons are arrows and crossbows bolts.

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 6:47 pm 
I am looking at this, btw - trying to figure out how this changes everything is a fairly big job.


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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 8:17 am 
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What I was aiming for, BTW, was that each of the classes would get feats that reward them specifically at the top of their game:
  • Casters have various extra spell feats - I've not changed those
  • Experts get more skills boosted by the skill feats than other classes - because they get more class skills, and the second boost from skill feats is granted at 9 ranks
  • Warriors get extra features to combat feats at BAB 6, and raged attacks are made more useful (so that casters aren't the only ranged attackers in the party)
As far as ranged goes, there's a little more to say:
Spoiler! :
The issue seems to come from needing too many feats to be any good at range.
Whereas Power Attack opens up a whole chain of feats, Deadly Aim gets you nothing - and Point Blank Shot, being the root of the ranged tree of feats, is not nearly as good as Power Attack - so I've added the benefits of Deadly Aim to Point Blank Shot: the root of the ranged tree should get the same sort of benefits as the root of the melee tree.

Far Shot increases the range at which the bonuses of Point Blank Shot and Sneak Attack apply.

Precise Shot seems to me to have the same in-game skill requirement as Deadly Aim - if you can shoot really accurately into melee, how is that different to shooting really accurately to get more damage? I've merged these two as well.

I merged Rapid Shot and Shot on the Run - I believe it is easier to shoot while moving than it is to make a melee strike while moving. There's no need for shot on the run to be a feat on its own, like Spring Attack.

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:09 am 
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Can't seem to find it at the moment, but a while ago I mentioned an idea for an expert to take feats to allow himself to have addition skills they can always take 10 in.

Did that ever make it?


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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:10 am 
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I remember that - sorry I didn't reply at the time.
I think it might be a bit too powerful to let Experts gain Skill Mastery on extra skills without limit. You'd be able to have skill Mastery on all your skills eventually, instead of the six that you get normally. Remember, no other class gets to take 10 like that.

Maybe the extra skill Mastery feat could only be taken once - what do you think?

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:16 am 
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That seems reasonable to me


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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:21 pm 
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I agree that the ranged combat needs boosting and like the idea of this. However, I have a concern in that having adjusted the first level spells my elf caster can now shoot a long bow to do d8 + 3 damage of cast a first level spell to do D6 + 6 damage (at 6th level). First level spellcaster can do d6 + 1 with a spell or d8 + 3 with a bow. Why would anybody bother with low level spells of this type?

I think the concern is more on the change to spells than the feats, however. Having played out most of my first level spells last time they may now be a little under powered.


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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:22 pm 
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Ranged attacks will be subject to armour and natural armour defence, whereas spells are touch attacks. Spell damage also bypasses most damage reduction.

So your bow attack, against an ogre, hits on an 11, and is subject to DR 4/-. You hit about 55% of the time (assuming BAB 0, DEX +3), and deal 3.5 average (after DR).
But your spell attack against the same ogre hits on an 8, and bypasses DR. You hit about 70% of the time, and deal 4.5 average (with no DR).

As you go up levels, spell damage automatically gets better, whereas you have to spend feats to improve your bow damage.

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 Post subject: Re: Updating feats
PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 12:39 pm 
Most of the feat changes seem ok, though there are a few oddities like the Quarry ability gained from Favoured Enemy autoconfirming critical threats (which were removed)

On a similar note, the Elven racial feats reference spells that no longer exist, like Flare and Dancing Lights.


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