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How should we move the league forward into S17
Poll ended at Fri Dec 16, 2016 2:46 pm
Stay as we are 1 more season 13%  13%  [ 1 ]
Switch to BB2016 with all new teams 88%  88%  [ 7 ]
Total votes : 8
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 Post subject: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 2:46 pm 
Blood Bowl Commissioner
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Hi all,

As you can see in the sign up thread, we currently will be looking at 2 continuing and (possibly) 4 rookie teams in division 1. This creates a problem with even the 2nd highest team getting a hefty 950k Inducements the league would potentially be a wash out of imbalance.

With that in mind I have spoken to those signed up to continue their teams, and whilst not totally keen on the idea are open minded enough to see how this could be a problem and have agreed to the possibility of a total restart of the league.

So to the poll, do we continue as we are, CRP+ for 1 more season, keep the existing teams and play as normal or do we wholesale change the teams, everyone starts again and we move to BB2016 ruleset. As we would be all using new teams it would make sense to change the ruleset at this point as teams will grow differently under BB2016.

For my part, I have previously stated I would prefer to let other people iron out the kinks in the new game system and change when that has been done, but logically it makes sense to change now (or else I wouldn't be proposing it)


Please please please vote and have your say...

Regards
D

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:17 am 
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Ok, I fully appreciate the teams staying on problem. Cant fault that logic, for my part i would happily take the plunge in division 1 to save any potentially new or inexperienced coaches the inevitable kicking they will get but you are right restarting the teams is fair.

I am not convinced on the new rule set as i have openly voiced. Some rules are unecessary additions (weaping dagger... really??) and others are simply a worse take on old rules and are punishing those of us that put time and effort into our teams which again imho is the complete wrong attitude to take.

Those players that like to bounce between teams season after season will not feel the pinch but those that like to watch teams grow and build character within their teams will have that taken from them and that for me is what i like the most about the game. Same reason i cant stand 40k but really enjoyed kill team.

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 7:47 am 
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I have heard your objections to the redraft, it is noted... you are however objecting to something that as yet we have seen no actual in league affect, once we do a theoretical redraft Wednesday, THEN we can assess its impact in the league and how to implement it... The number of games played isn't set and at commissioners discression, what we can say for sure is that it's not designed for 10 games so we DEFINATLEY wont be redrafting after every individual season on the DVBBL.

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 2:36 pm 
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I'm up for a clean start with the new rules, I've been switching back and forth between carrying on with the vamps or starting a new team and it seems like a good point for a refresh.

It's a pain for the established sides obviously but they'd need to reset at some point with the new rules coming in anyway.

Only concern is that I don't know which teams are available in the new version.

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 5:39 pm 
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Only Slann are missing, and I've told Jack we'll just keep them as is until something different comes out (or they stay as is forever).

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 11:53 am 
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I heard a rumor that Slann are all AG4 in the new GW book ;)

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 1:11 pm 
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I heard that too.. but the cheapest lino is 140k and you'd start with 7 frogs and 1 reroll

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 8:36 pm 
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Voted for full 2016. I've done some numbers and the discussion of which is too long and tedious for text from a phone but imo it should work. This is based on my thoughts that the current system doesn't work anyway when in the 2mil region.No reason this should stop team continuation; what's killed that is a lack of commitment from coaches to rivalries, back story and participation on forum (imo).


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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 1:56 am 
Motor Mouth
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Im sure I already asked this but cant find the post anywhere so here goes again...

Has anyone compiled all of the differences that I would need to implement in level10 (I would need someone to compile them for me as I am out of the loop mostly now)?
Roster Changes
Star player changes
Stat Changes
Skill Selection Changes
Value Changes
Inducement Changes

There is potentially a lot of changes need making and not a lot of time for me to do them in if you continue to discuss this much longer

When do you need me to make the changes by?

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 6:45 am 
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I would be making this list pretty quickly Lee if we go ahead with it. I was hoping for a few more votes... but league forum participation has tailed off since you moved on... there are a lot of positional name changes that I'm not sure we really need to alter, but not a lot of substance changes. star players have been significantly chopped, but I wasn't sure if we should take them out only to put them back in at a later date, I was just going to write a post on here on which ones can currently be selected...

Things that actually matter in RED

Abbreviations
BB - Core Blood Bowl rules
DZS1 - Death Zone Season 1 rules
DZS1E - Death Zone Season 1 errata (PDF)
FAQ - FAQ document (PDF)
ToL - Teams of Legend (PDF)

Roster Changes
Amazon (ToL, p1)
Linewoman - Renamed to Tribal Linewoman.
Thrower - Renamed to Eagle Warrior Thrower.
Catcher - Renamed to Piranha Warrior Catcher.
Blitzer - Renamed to Koka Kalim Blitzer.

Chaos Dwarf (ToL, p2)
Hobgoblin - Renamed to Hobgoblin Runner.
Bull Centaur - Renamed to Bull Centaur Blitzer.
Minotaur - Renamed to Enslaved Minotaur.

Chaos Pact (ToL, p2)
Team renamed to "Chaos Renegades"
Marauder - Renamed to Renegade Human Lineman
Goblin Renegade - Renamed to Renegade Goblin
Skaven Renegade - Renamed to Renegade Skaven Lineman
Dark Elf Renegade - Renamed to Renegade Dark Elf Lineman
Chaos Troll - Renamed to Troll
Chaos Ogre - Renamed to Ogre

Chaos (ToL, p3)
Team renamed to "Chaos Chosen"
Beastman - Renamed to Beastman Runner
Chaos Warrior - Renamed to Chosen Blocker

Elf (DZS1, p??)
Team renamed to "Elven Union"

Goblin (ToL, p3)
Bombardier - Renamed to Bomma

Halfling (ToL, p5)
Halfling - Renamed to Halfling Hopeful
Treeman - Gains Timmm-ber! skill

Human (DZS1, p45)
Catcher - Cost changed from 70k to 60k. Reverts to Av7
Ogre Cost reverts to 140k from 130k



Khemri (ToL, p5)
Team renamed to "Khemri Tomb Kings"
Skeleton - Renamed to Skeleton Lineman
Thro-Ra - Renamed to Anointed Thrower Loses the skill thick skull
Blitz-Ra - Renamed to Anointed Blitzer Loses the skill thick skull
Tomb Guardian reverts to original 4 5 1 9 decay regeneration - loses break tackle, gains +1 Av and decay

Lizardman (ToL, p6)
Skink - Renamed to Skink Runner
Saurus - Renamed to Saurus Blocker

Norse (ToL, p6)
Lineman - Renamed to Norse Lineman
Thrower - Renamed to Norse Thrower
Catcher - Renamed to Norse Catcher
Berserker - Renamed to Norse Berserker
Ulfwerener - Renamed to Ulfwerenar (possibly. Is this a singular vs plural form?)
Snow Troll - Renamed to Yhetee

Necromantic (ToL, p7)
Team renamed to "Necromantic Horror"
Ghoul - Renamed to Ghoul Runner
Wight - Renamed to Wight Blitzer

Nurgle (DZS1, p45)
Nurgle Warrior - Renamed to Bloater
Beast of Nurgle - Renamed to Rotspawn

Skaven (DZS1, p46)
Gutter Runner - Gains Weeping Dagger skill.

Undead (ToL, p7)
Team renamed to "Shambling Undead"
Skeleton - Renamed to Skeleton Lineman
Ghoul - Renamed to Ghoul Runner
Wight - Renamed to Wight Blitzer

Ogre (ToL, p8)
Snotling - Renamed to Runt

Underworld (ToL, p8)
Team renamed to "Underworld Denizens"
Underworld Goblin - Renamed to Goblin
Warpstone Troll - Renamed to Troll

Vampire (ToL, p9)
Thrall - Renamed to Thrall Lineman
Vampire - Renamed to Vampire Blitzer

Skill Changes
Piling On - Effectively removed from official rules. Is mentioned as an option to commissioners who want it, with some changes (requires TRR to use). (DZS1, p29)
Timmm-ber! - New skill. Assists for standing low-MA players up (DZS1, p37)
Weeping Dagger - New skill. 50% chance to turn badly hurt injuries to MNG. (DZS1, p37)

Other Changes
Wizard inducement has been removed. (DZS1, p23+28)
Argue the Call is back. D6 roll, 1=coach sent off (-1 brilliant coaching modifier), 6=player sent to reserves. Still generates a turnover. (DZS1, p38 and FAQ)
MVP changes. Coach picks 3 players and rolls a D3 for the MVP award. Process for concessions are not clear. Does the winner get to choose a new set of three for the second MVP? Also requires a head coach miniature to apply. (DZS1, p21+24)
Spiralling Expenses - Effectively removed. (DZS1, p29)
Expensive Mistakes replaces Spiralling Expenses. (DZS1, p25)
Special Play Cards system redesigned, with new cards. Note that there is a special web pre-order card in circulation as well. (DZS1, p23 and card deck in the box.)
Inducements system redesigned. Adding gold to petty cash does not change TV. (DZS1, p23)
League system with seasons (DZS1, mainly p18+19+26+27)
Star Players have been revised. (Card deck + DZS1, p47)
Bloodweiser Babes inducement renamed to Bloodweiser Kegs (DZS1, p23)

I pickup my copy of Deathzone Wednesday, I would be making the final decision when I have the actual hard paper copy in front of me (looks pretty 1 sided currently) Kick off the new season 16/01/17

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 4:32 pm 
Motor Mouth
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If a re-set and new rules attracts new players. Thats the vote.

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:04 pm 
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I voted for new rules I'm happy for non-reset if people wish to keep teams but if I'm going to re-learn blood bowl I'd prefer it to be in a way I can attend other "official" gw tournaments in fact I was tempted by the one at Warhammer world but thought I'd be working


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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 11:35 pm 
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Unless there is a major swing in the next 24 hours, its pretty clear which way we'll be going.

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2016 6:41 am 
Motor Mouth
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What categories are these skills in? Are you keeping or removing piling on?

Skill Changes
Piling On - Effectively removed from official rules. Is mentioned as an option to commissioners who want it, with some changes (requires TRR to use). (DZS1, p29)
Timmm-ber! - New skill. Assists for standing low-MA players up (DZS1, p37)
Weeping Dagger - New skill. 50% chance to turn badly hurt injuries to MNG. (DZS1, p37)

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 Post subject: Re: The Shape of Season 17! please have your say
PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2016 8:22 am 
Motor Mouth
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I think the changes are made (In a temp site for now)

Please take a look at
http://www.level10.org/BB2016/index.php ... 3&obj_id=1

and confirm EVERY Stat, Name, Assigned Skills, Single/Double Skills and Value for each team.
(It would probably be easiest if everyone takes responsibility for 3-4 teams)

I have had to re-jig the database A LOT. This means that there is a chance when I put the new rules live on the site I may need to delete Some/All of the old teams.

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